For our final interview, we’re joined for a second time by the majestic Chris Packham, our first ‘proper’ guest all the way back in 2015.

We discuss all that has changed in those seven and a half years, not least some pretty hardcore stuff for Chris personally, and we chew over what the world of activism and protest might look like seven years hence, given things continue to go so spectacularly to shit.

Talking of shit, we discover that Chris Packham is full of it – so much so that he’s put his favourite wildlife poo pics in a calendar for 2023 (available to order here, if you’re into that sort of thing).

The reality of making telly programmes; Pete Waterman’s love of steam trains; our genetic predisposition to hate brussel sprouts; Mick Hucknell; photographing dead things; Michaela Strachan’s 80s club nights – it’s all ticked off in a wide-ranging chat with a man who is evidently more driven than ever to do everything and anything in his power to fight for the living world. Cheers, Chris.

Sustainababble is your friendly environment podcast, out weekly. Theme music by the legendary Dicky Moore – @dickymoo. Sustainababble logo by the splendid Arthur Stovell at Design by Mondial. Ecoguff read out by Arabella.

Love the babble? Bung us a few pennies at


Available on iTunes, Spotify, Acast & all those types of things, or at Visit us at @thebabblewagon and at Email us at