Green party leader Natalie Bennett’s “excruciating” interview hit the headlines this week. For more auspicious reasons, so did president Obama and his Keystone veto. But are we putting too much stock in the actions of our leaders? Can the planet ever be saved by powerful individuals?

Also this week, vaporising birds, burger tossing scientists, and a star turn from Ol’s five year old niece.

Sustainababble is a weekly podcast for and by greeny types who don’t really know what’s going on. It comes out every Monday.

Music by Dicky Moore from Bearcraft.

Available on iTunes, Stitcher, Soundcloud, and on the sustainababble website. Visit us at @thebabblewagon and at